Adam Callinan (00:25)
Let's be good storytellers and start at your beginning.
Emmanauel (00:30)
Alright, yeah, let's start there, that's a great idea. So, for story's sake, I was found in a box on a battlefield in Iraq by two soldiers who heard a baby cry and they went towards that baby and they saw me and they realized that that baby was me and they took me to an orphanage where I was then raised there for the next seven years of my life.
and then at the seventh year the Chippendales had heard about me and thought let's recruit this and and build him up as a seven-year-old and I took over Chippendales when I was 18 legal obviously had to be Of legal age yep yep, but they did train me for from seven till you know you think Cristiano Ronaldo and all these you know LeMans ymel at Barcelona train
Adam Callinan (01:03)
Ha ha ha ha ha
Yeah.
Yeah, of course.
Emmanauel (01:24)
When they're five, well, I'll you what, being a Chippendale dancer, you got to start, you got to start at least seven or eight. No, I was though taken to an orphanage. It's a good one, isn't it? it's a little bit more. No, look, was raised in that orphanage for the next seven years, seeing and experiencing executions, gunshots, every day wondering whether it was going to be my last.
Adam Callinan (01:33)
I haven't heard that story. So that was a good version of the story. I think your other one's probably more impactful, but we can take that one.
Emmanauel (01:54)
day on earth. But the one thing that kind of kept me going was hope. Hope that somebody was going to help, you know, come and rescue me and I would be able to take advantage of that rescue, rescue in and turn my life into something extraordinary. Whatever that extraordinary looked like, I had no idea, but certainly had hope. And every day that hope just flushed through my veins.
I think the biggest part of the hope though that I had was not so much that somebody would come and rescue me, but that I would just live that day. I would live long enough to see that person come and rescue me or experience that. So, behold, that hope kind of stood strong. And when I was seven years old, an incredible woman, Moira Kelly, humanitarian, ran projects for Mother Teresa, ran projects for...
for the Pope, for Queen of England. She's an extraordinary woman. She came to Iraq and met my now brother, Ahmed, who was my brother in the orphanage as well. And it took her about two and a half years to take us to Australia. when she first met us, well, first of all, she met us when we were around about...
five, six years old and then it took her two and a half years to get us out to Australia. I came out to Australia around seven and a half, eight years of age. But when we first met, Aunty Moira, we called her. My brother goes up to her and he says, know, Aunty Moira, can you take Emmanuel and I, can you save us both? And she said, I'll do my best, but I don't know. And my brother turns around and he goes, well, if you can't help Emmanuel and I, just take Emmanuel and don't worry about me. Come back for me another time. He wasn't even my blood brother.
He wasn't my blood brother. He wasn't related to me by blood. But I think in those moments and when I heard that story, because I didn't even know my brother did that until mum, mum who I call her now, Moira, mum I call her now, told me years later and told both my brother and I that story and said that that's one of her most beautiful memories. in that moment, I realized the only thing that's actually thicker than blood is love, right? My brother's love and
and shieldedness for me, is that even a word? Shieldedness. It is now. I make up words, just pre-warning. And so now, from that five, six, seven years, from that five, six year old, hope turned into not just hope, but also love, right? This kind of...
Adam Callinan (04:19)
We'll take it. Yeah.
That's fine. I know you meant it.
Emmanauel (04:43)
this beautiful relationship between my brother and I and him protecting me and minding me and raising me up and me raising him up mostly through taking the slack of all the naughty things he did for him. I'd be the one that took the blame for it even though it wasn't my fault. So we just built, we became brothers. That's what it came down to. Eventually I came out to Australia at the age of seven.
I have a bunch of surgeries over the next sort of eight years. think 16 was my final, age 16 was the last surgery I had. And in those surgeries, after the third surgery is when I actually learned how to walk for the first time. So around about 11 years of age, I learned how to walk for the first time.
Adam Callinan (05:32)
Can you,
you know that I know the answer to a lot of these questions, but I think they're important as far as telling the story.
Emmanauel (05:38)
Mmm. Mmm.
Adam Callinan (05:43)
I deeply appreciate that this is not what or who you are and it does not define you, but it is part of you and it is part of your story. Was it your biological mom was exposed to some chemical weapons and that created some challenges.
Emmanauel (05:54)
Yeah, yeah, the belief
Yeah, no, the belief is that my exactly that my biological parents were exposed to the chemicals that were already in existing weapons, right bombs, etc, etc. There was there was Obviously proof that Iraq didn't have chemical weapons in the end. However, it doesn't matter. I mean chemical
official chemical biochemical weapons or not, at the end of the day, there are chemicals in weapons and those chemicals, whether it's gum powder or something else, can affect pregnancy. So yeah, was thought that my parents, my mother specifically was exposed during pregnancy and that's how I ended up this extraordinarily good looking. So, and my brother on the other hand, he was born,
He was born like that. mean, what we always sometimes say is, you know, God, God focused so hardly and so much on my face that he just basically said, I can't be stuffed finishing the rest. He's right. He's right to go. And mainly that's because I probably talked him to death. talked her head, whatever God is, talked God to death and God just booted me out in the end and said, you what, you've got enough. You're good looking. That'll do.
Adam Callinan (07:19)
Hahaha
Emmanauel (07:20)
It was either that or this is what you get when you order an Arab from Ikea wonky bits and missing parts So so no, but that's that's that's essentially what what we believe Happened and so when I came out right I I had to learn how to walk You know I got a prosthetic I had to learn how to use a knife and fork the doctors made a hand out of and it you know made a hand for me so I could hold
You know, I could hold mugs and cups and glasses and you know, all that sort of stuff. So it allowed me to be more self-sufficient than I already was, which is awesome. But also those surgeries taught me another little, I suppose, key part in my life and that's determination, right?
to want to fight through anything and everything that I have. I think we're all born with those gifts. We are, that's the truth of it. Because they are, determination, willpower, hope, all of them, they're gifts, right? And we're all born with it. The difficult challenge in life is how do you trigger those gifts, right? How do you trigger them to activate and work for you instead of necessarily be hidden and shunned and pushed down deep?
and instead other laziness and loss of will or loss of hope ends up being triggered. And I think that's, a big portion of that is probably the people that you surround yourself with. And I learned that the hard way which will go through the story of what then all kind of transpired. But yeah, I came out to Australia when I was seven.
Adam Callinan (08:53)
Mm.
Emmanauel (09:10)
eight years old, had a bunch of surgeries and learned how to walk, learned how to use a knife and fork, hold a glass, all the main things that we take for granted. With one hand, that is. I used to use two hands, still held a glass when I was a kid. then, you know, learned that I could use my gifts as a tool to deliver the message I want to deliver in the world. Learned self-love, learned all those things that you have to learn as a young person, lost it.
then learned to, you know, got it back again. And then, and then eventually went on a TV show, X Factor performed imagine. And that led me to come into the US and working with some amazing people from bloody Quincy Jones to Snoop Doggy Dog. Every day he thought my arm was growing back. kept having to tell him he's high. You didn't know that story. Did you, Adam? Yeah, there's a story for you. There we go.
Adam Callinan (10:04)
I didn't, I didn't, no.
Emmanauel (10:07)
And so I got to do some pretty cool things and then I met this unique, very sort of quiet chap who's not so quiet these days I feel like. come out of his shell a little bit. And also super nerdy geeky dude named Adam Kellanen. I know him.
Adam Callinan (10:29)
Yeah, yours truly.
That's particularly accurate on the last part. Let's back up a little bit. You mentioned
Emmanauel (10:33)
Yes!
Adam Callinan (11:19)
how old were you when you went on X factor? Like 18 or 17? Okay.
Emmanauel (11:20)
I was 17 when
I first auditioned. The show went live when I was 18.
Adam Callinan (11:28)
Got it. You mentioned a period in there before that where you lost or misplaced self-love.
Emmanauel (11:39)
Yeah, so I actually lost.
Adam Callinan (11:42)
I
bring like quickly I bring this up because it is so counter to who you are as a as a human. So I there's probably a gem in there somewhere.
Emmanauel (11:52)
Yeah, no, I lost self love actually after X factor, not war. I think when you get something given to you really, really quickly and you don't have people to cultivate it and guide you, through that cultivation and you've just got somebody just cultivating it like it's a, like it's a, it's a, like it's a pimp, you know, you're almost, you're almost
Adam Callinan (11:57)
Really? Okay.
Emmanauel (12:20)
you're a product of a pimp, right? In that sense. And that's all you have. And no one's actually serving as also a mentor and a guide. What happens is you get lost in this world of, especially in Hollywood, you get lost in this world of glitz and glamour and money and fame and fake love. And you think fake love is real love. And so you replace your own self-love with that fake love, right?
Adam Callinan (12:47)
Mm.
Emmanauel (12:48)
And when you replace that fake love from people, fans, things like that, who don't really know who you are, they just love you. And that's okay, that's bloody great. That's part of the game, that's part of the industry. But the trick is not to replace it with your self-love, but when you replace it with your self-love, you lose your self-love. better yet, you don't lose it, you bury it.
then it becomes a really, really, really heavy spade when you grab that spade to go and dig up that, I suppose, self-love that you've buried, right? And it's super heavy and it's been concreted up and it's no longer just dirt covering it. It's fucking tomb. So you have to find a way to break that tomb down and bring out that...
Adam Callinan (13:28)
Got it.
Emmanauel (13:45)
that self love and that took me some time. Like when I lost that self love, I lost all my money. I lost all my, I suppose, will to wanting to succeed. And it was only for a limited of time, thank goodness. it's, but it begun with that motion. It's like when I lost all that money, I lost the people that I thought were there for me and supporting me.
Adam Callinan (13:49)
Mm.
Emmanauel (14:13)
I already had this, I suppose, set of humans who didn't want me to achieve, or at least didn't believe I could achieve, not necessarily want me or not. I don't think they really cared either way, they just didn't believe I could achieve. that was the, you know, 55 % of the music industry, the others were made up of fans and, and, and celeb mates who were just there to support because it, it, it, it made them feel good.
Adam Callinan (14:41)
Mm-hmm.
Emmanauel (14:42)
We didn't, didn't have that belief factor from record labels and things like that. And, and, and, and so you've got all that and a bunch of people saying no. And then you've got a bunch of people saying, love you. We love you. love you. And it, it clashes. And then you, in that clashing moment, you need something to, you need something to feel like you, what you need to feel like you need to strengthen your own self love. And so you do that by.
grabbing the fake love and then before you know it you're replacing that self love with that fake love.
Adam Callinan (15:17)
How did you break out of that? Yeah, it does make sense. What triggered or what were the steps you took to get through that?
Emmanauel (15:24)
Actually, I think there's this mindset that people have. You know when people say you sometimes have to hit true rock bottom before you can make it, I hit rock bottom. I ended up homeless. And it was the same time I knew you. It was the same time I knew Anthony and Tiennes and all the people that I knew already.
Adam Callinan (15:37)
Yeah.
Emmanauel (15:53)
everybody didn't know was that night I was either sleeping in a car or I was I was I was homeless and and maybe you'd suspected a couple times, you know, because I might have reached out a few times and said hey man, can I come over? You know, I wanted to talk about this but really I just needed a place to stay that night and then it was it was it was it was one day when I It was literally one day. I was on the on
Adam Callinan (16:11)
Yeah.
Emmanauel (16:20)
on a park bench just sitting in Santa Monica. was 5 a.m. in the morning. I'd slept there that night because it was a warm night and I just saw a sunrise and I had this flash of memory of Iraq and the child that I was with just that determination, that willpower and that hope. And I realized in that moment, I think I've hit rock bottom here.
And I need to let go of all my ego, let go of all my pride and ask for help. And so actually one of the people I asked for help was funny enough was Tony and I called him. knew, you know, being a devout Muslim, he'd be up at 5 a.m. in the morning. So I thought, okay, I'm gonna, I'm gonna call this guy because no one else will be up. And I said, I need your help. And he said, what do you need? And I said, I need you first of all to promise you won't.
tell anybody until I'm ready to tell this story one day and I don't know when that one day is but I need your help and this is what I need your help with and I actually share that and Tony shares that in our documentary that comes out later this year. But I hit rock bottom and then when I hit rock bottom I asked key people for help.
Adam Callinan (17:44)
you
Emmanauel (17:45)
And when I got the help, just started putting notes up on my wall and saying, right, I'm going to do this. I'm going to do that. was like, rejuvenated, you know, it was, you know, it was like a reset, you know? And, and now I realize, but that reset completed itself because it was a long reset. It was a, you know, two and a half year reset.
or longer actually, it was more like a six year reset to be honest, but that reset sort of finished in about 2018 and then stage one of the rebuild began and that was in 2018 and it just slowly, there was a setback during COVID but kept fighting on, kept moving forward and one of the things that I needed to do
that got me through that stage one and got me through that setback was finding what my purpose would be and that's where Outlier came into play and what I wanted to do with that and I remember calling you and saying hey I need you know I'm thinking of doing this I need your help Chris Martin supporting it and and you introduced me to I remember a COO at the time who I was having conversations with him to see if there was stuff we can do but the point was it was keeping my brain and my
passion and my willpower and my, you know, it was keeping me active. It was keeping me working. It's like when you're an 80 year old, you know, when you're 80 years of age, the best thing to keep your mind active and keep working is to do what? It's working in the garden. It's driving people. It's having constant conversations with people. It keeps you young. It keeps you fresh. It keeps you active. And it was kind of like that. Me just finding
a way to achieve my purpose gave me, it gave me, it gave my willpower and determination fuel, if that makes sense.
Adam Callinan (19:52)
It does. You were unbelievably gifted at hiding that situation. had no idea that, I I very much remember that time period. I had no idea that you were in that situation.
Emmanauel (20:08)
And most people didn't and that's the truth of it. I didn't want people to know. One thing I never wanted people to do was play the pity party with Emmanuel, right? And the truth is, you know, I'd known well enough, it's not something people can control, you know? So even if you don't think or even if somebody, mean, Tony gave it, everybody gives it. They don't mean to, it's not a,
You can't control that, right? It's part of human nature and it's good. It's a beautiful part of human nature. But I'd already, because I'm differently able, because I'm an outlier, it's like I knew I have to work whatever a person with arms and legs who is in the world. And frankly, I don't care whether you're black, white, yellow, you're missing arms, you're missing legs. The truth is anybody that wants to achieve a level of success
has to always, no matter who you are, work 10 times harder than the person above you or below you, right? In order to achieve what you want to succeed. You have to, right? But when it comes to achieving a purpose and whatever that purpose is, you have to work about 50 times harder because a purpose is something that is legacy. It's something that...
not only satisfies your internal spirituality, your internal heart, your mind, all that sort of stuff, but it also satisfied that satisfies the, your own universal belief of what you can achieve. Does that make sense? So for me, as a, as a, as an individual who's from Australia, who has the story that I have coming into LA,
Adam Callinan (21:53)
does.
Emmanauel (22:05)
The truth is, I'd already gauged people's empathy and sympathy, fake love and real love, right? The one thing I didn't want was then to pull out the part of, hey, by the way, I'm now homeless and I need more help. I didn't want to be that guy who people thought of thought that guy's gonna do it, but you know, he keeps needing help. You don't wanna be, I didn't wanna be that person.
Adam Callinan (22:34)
Yep.
Emmanauel (22:35)
And maybe it
was for my own sanity. Maybe I just needed to feel like I need to find a way out on my own for my own pride. But even with pride, even with ego, even with all those things, I then had to come to realization that I had to let go of that. And I wasn't now doing it for my own ego or pride. I was doing it first for survival and then second to achieve
what I set out to achieve, to be that child that I was in that orphanage with hope, with gratitude towards the universe, but most of all with willpower to make the difference I was put on this earth to make a difference. And I don't even know what that difference is yet. I may never know, but I know I'm supposed to do something because those soldiers would not have stopped shooting at one another.
if there wasn't, and they wouldn't have heard me cry, if there wasn't some kind of cosmic reason. And maybe it was just bloody dumb luck, but I choose to believe that there's some cosmic reason that I'm where I am. And if it's bloody dumb luck, then geez, I must be one hell of a lucky person. So, and I'll take that as well, but I'm gonna turn that luck into something more than just luck.
Adam Callinan (23:55)
Yeah, I think the world is far too interconnected in ways that we don't understand to call something like that luck.
So if we look back in this must have been like 2016 or 17, you and I went to a LA Rams game. Remember that? Of course. There was a bit of walk. Yeah, it's unfortunately you can't just like drive right up to the stadium. At least I couldn't. I didn't have the right pass or connection or whatever.
Emmanauel (24:19)
Yes, I remember that. A of walking. Wasn't happy about it.
Next time we go VIP
box seats. Oh no, no, we didn't go VIP. We didn't go VIP. Yeah, yeah.
Adam Callinan (24:36)
Yeah, we did end up in a box
seat. one of the things that I deeply admire and appreciate and why I like having you in my life in any way possible is that I knew that that was hard.
Emmanauel (24:56)
Mm. Yeah.
Adam Callinan (24:57)
For you, I
knew that it was difficult because we did have to walk a lot. were a ton of stairs. It just like, there's no other way to get into at that point. I think it was at the Coliseum in LA, which is an old like Roman era style football stadium. So it's not easy. Yeah, it's an epic place, but it's not easy to get into. And not one time did I feel like you were upset about it, complaining. Like you fricking lived for it.
Emmanauel (25:12)
I mean, it's an epic play.
yeah, I love it.
Adam Callinan (25:28)
Like
how do you
Do you think about that or is it just like who you are because of where you've been and where you've come from and your personality?
Emmanauel (25:38)
Like I said, I think everybody is like that. Every single human being has that in them. mean, scientists are saying that potentially humans, or at least our brains, the universe trying to make itself conscious, right? So if we have that, the power of the universe inside us, right, we are capable of anything and everything, right?
The trick is triggering it. What is that trigger for you? What is the domino for you? What's that domino for? What gets you? For me, it's challenge. If something was just too easy, I think I would just get bored. I'd start playing PS5 all day and I'd just be bored. So for me, the trigger is actually the challenge.
Adam Callinan (26:10)
Yeah.
Emmanauel (26:35)
I enjoy, I invite the challenge, I invite contest, invite arguments and contention and I love that, I feed off it and I want people to question my belief system, I want to be able to question other people's belief systems to see how resolute each individual is because if you are resolute through that process then...
Adam Callinan (26:36)
Hmm.
Emmanauel (27:04)
The truth is, you are meant to be doing what you're doing, right? Being the President of the United States or that's the one thing I respect about the current guy. I mean, I'm not a fan, but it doesn't matter whether I'm a fan. The man is resolute in his endeavors, right? And whatever that looks like, that to me, I respect that. Now, when you enact it in a way that is negative towards society,
Adam Callinan (27:10)
Mm.
Emmanauel (27:35)
that draws me away. So when you enact it, that benefits you, your family and society in some way, shape or form. And it could be that you donate a bit of money every year to a charity that you love or you support talent or in your case, you were awesome in what you did, but you also, your way was being a part of my life, supporting my endeavors, whatever that looked like. So therefore in my opinion,
If I achieve, when I achieve the things I want to achieve, you are a cog in that achievement, right? And therefore, as far as I'm concerned, your success, the success that you've achieved in your life, you have satisfied, right? Satisfied the cosmic reason of existence for yourself, right?
You may not think so, as far as I am and why, because you've helped somebody else, you were a part of that cog, right? You've helped somebody else achieve something. And so if you can just be a grain of sand in that achievement, then you've done something right in your life. And so whatever that looks like, but people that do it more,
I'm all for that and I love it. But for me, it's the challenge. It's every single challenge that we have in our lives. And for me, it's the challenge of achieving something that everybody doesn't, that people don't quite believe it can be done, but want to see it done. Does that make sense? And in this, it's what I'm doing with Outly. It's, I mean, I sat at...
Adam Callinan (29:14)
it does.
Emmanauel (29:19)
As, as people say, it's a bad thing and it's sad that we live in this society that I was the first differently abled physical or differently abled in general to do a stadium tour as a solo act, not, you know, a part of a band because I'm a drummer. No, no, no. Like as a Emmanuel Kelly billing act, right. As a, as an opening act on build, right. That is a billing thing. It's not like I'm a part of a something and I'm the first differently able to ever do a stadium act like that.
First physical differently able to do a stadium act in general. Bless you. So, by the way, you shouldn't hold your sneezes. It can give you a...
Adam Callinan (29:58)
I didn't,
I just covered my mouth so I didn't spit all over my microphone. Yeah, I'm good. Blow your head up.
Emmanauel (30:01)
Okay, cool. Because it, you know,
can give you an aneurysm or something, apparently. Anyway, so, so, yeah, so, so the fact that I was that person to me, I don't, I don't mind the, that reality because yes, if somebody else had done it, great, I'd be happy for it. And I'd find a new challenge. But to me, it was the challenge. was challenge number one.
Adam Callinan (30:08)
You
Yeah.
Emmanauel (30:29)
Now challenge number two is this company, is the film and television stuff. It's more music. It's the growth of that. So for me, my trigger is challenges.
Adam Callinan (30:40)
Let's talk about challenge number one and how you got to that. Let's go back. When you were a five-year-old in the orphanage, you singing? Like, have you just been singing your entire life? Okay, I mean, I know you've been talking your entire life, but singing, you've just been singing for forever.
Emmanauel (30:53)
Yeah. Yes. Yeah.
Forever, since I was in the orphanage, would be making up melodies left, right and center. What's funny is singing, I love singing a lot. I love being on stage, I love performing. But funny enough, singing and music wasn't my, wasn't my passion nor purpose. It was a passion, but it wasn't my sole passion and purpose. What singing gave me was,
the challenge of being the first differently able to ever make it commercially, right? Actors have done it, you you've got the Peter Dinklage's and things like that. So you've had some kind of element to that, but also acting, there've been plenty of actors who are differently able that have made it in some way, shape or form, whether it's TV or film, you know, commercially.
right, whether they've had a role or whatever and commercial success and acting is a little bit different to music. There's never been a pop artist that's physically differently abled in history.
Adam Callinan (32:09)
How
did you go from, I mean, X Factor happened when you were in the 17, 18 range. How did you go from that to, I'm gonna jump like a decade plus ahead to this last year, you opened for Coldplay on 12 concerts all over the world. Like what happened? Obviously a lot happened in between that that didn't happen overnight. So it started at X Factor, what happened next?
Emmanauel (32:17)
Right.
to it.
Chris and I met on Tinder and the rest is history. So after that period of homelessness and trying to find a way out, I mean, I was signed to a label, got dropped, I mean, it was a whole thing. So that's kind of when it all just spun out of control in that sense.
Adam Callinan (32:41)
They just can't help it. I love it. Yeah.
I remember that actually. Yeah.
Emmanauel (33:09)
but after, after all that, and after I, you know, served myself the pity bath and, and reveled all through it and, and washed myself and, know, and, and, and really oiled myself up, I then washed it off and, and wash that, that pity, pity soap and, and put up literally, I kid you not, I put up a note on the wall and every day I looked at that note and then I put another note.
that says the same thing on top of it. And it was like a pile that just built up on top of it saying, I will perform with a major artist by the end of this year and a legendary artist by the end of this year to reset and restart this stage of my life. And every single day I made a hundred phone calls, literally. I think I remember like,
One of the days I might've even called you like three times just to double check that you didn't know somebody. It was one of those things I said, are you sure you know? And I called everyone, I called Anthony, I went to lunches, I forced people to pay for those lunches because I was broke. But I went to them, I dropped every major card, I...
Adam Callinan (34:12)
Ha ha.
Emmanauel (34:30)
said listen, can I, know, imagine me performing with a legend and I had a list of artists, imagine what it would do for that artist. Like I had a whole pitch lined up. Funny part is I didn't put it on paper. Like I didn't put the pitch on paper. It was all here. I knew what I wanted to deliver and I knew what I wanted to say. And, and I just kept going, kept going, kept going, kept going. And eventually I, I ended up crashing into
an individual who knew an individual and that individual said listen I've got I've got a friend of mine and I'm gonna send it to them and their name is Habib and I put that to the side I said okay well look I need to go to Utah because I can't stay where I am here and I've got you know somebody that's willing to put me up for a month and a half in Utah so I drove to Utah I stayed there for that month
and never heard back from that person. But I kept making the phone calls. I kept doing everything I needed to, kept putting it on my wall, kept saying, I'm going to do it by the end of the year. I'm going to do it by the end of the year. I'm going to do it by the end of the year. And this was, this was 20, this was 2017. And I, I ended up eventually that a phone call I made, I didn't even know who it was because I'd made so many, but a phone call I made.
Connected me to a person that person who I haven't spoken to ever again for whatever reason no reason Connect me just said hey, you're awesome. I'm gonna connect you with somebody else who's connected connect me with somebody else that person said listen I'm gonna send this video your video to a few people and about 48 hours I get a 48 hours later My godfather gets a phone call from a guy named. Dr. Habib Sadagi
And he says, can you come to LA? I said, yeah, I'm in Utah. goes, no worries. I'll pay for your petrol. Just come to LA. Come see me. Come, come to my clinic in Agoura Hills. And he says, because I want to introduce you to some people. And I'm thinking, what am I doing? Why would I just go to LA? And I don't know. And I asked him like, who are the types of people you want to introduce me to? And he goes, everybody on your list. I can introduce you to. said, you have my list. says, yes. said, okay.
Alright, I'll come to LA and he goes also I've spoken to your mother. I said, shit So he did and he genuinely did he instead of coming through the person that actually sent him the video Obviously, it just roundabouts I think like at least like I don't know how many people live in Hollywood But I'm telling you I reckon every third person got that video in that in that six months and
Adam Callinan (36:57)
Hahaha!
Emmanauel (37:21)
And, but Habib didn't know how to get in touch with me. So best way, best way he knew how to get in touch with me was bloody call my mom in Australia. So he called my mom cause she has a charity and she says, yeah, Emmanuel. Yeah. I'm sure. Yeah. I'm I can connect you Mr. Habib. And so anyway, long story short, we go to LA. I sit with Habib. goes, okay, who out of your list is the number one person you want to, you want to connect with us? It's, it's cold playing. He goes, okay, cool.
Said, no promises, but what I do want you to do right now is say, hi Chris, my name is Emmanuel Kelly and this is my story and I want to perform with you. I said, is it Chris Martin? Is that who you're talking about? And he goes, I'm not gonna say, but I will tell you, the person that you're sending this to is a Chris. said, you know, and this is how Habib works. It's a little annoying, but it's his way and it's beautiful. Anyway.
I said, when should I expect to hear back from somebody? And he says, he says, I don't know, it could be a month, it could be two weeks, it could be six months, but you're my brother, treatments are on the house. I great, all right, can I have a massage? And all that sort of stuff. And every month I do a gathering and my clients typically come to that gathering and his clients included everyone from.
Will Smith and the Smith family to Kennedy's to Coldplay to Gwyneth Paltrow to you know, Javier Baradem are sung at his birthday. Thanks to you know for happy but I didn't even know I singing for Javier Baradem until he bloody walks in so, you know, it's all these Just a bunch of amazing humans but also humans that are part of the industry and and you know, and beepers like a spiritual advisor and family practitioner to these guys So anyway, long story short
I don't leave LA at the time. asked Habib if, you know, again, I mean, if there was a competition at somebody figuring out how to get free accommodation, I mean, I reckon I'd be close up there. should be a competitor in this at the time anyway. But Habib takes care of us and it was myself and my godfather, Peter. I stick around, Peter sticks around and then Peter actually goes back to Australia and then I just stick it out.
for the next couple years. Habib, about three weeks later, before Peter left, we're back in Utah and Peter gets the phone call and it's this guy named Phil and Phil says, hi, I'm Phil and I work for the band called Coldplay. sorry, I'm from England. and I work for Coldplay and he goes, right.
I've never heard of the town Coldplay in England. Can you tell me more?" And the guy goes, no, no, I'm from the band. Right. Okay. That's a very interesting name. The band. Okay. I mean, the guy was just all over the place. And anyway, ends, he hangs up the phone and I said, Peter, who was that? And he goes, I don't know, some guy named Phil and he's from a band called Coldplay or Oldplay I think it is. Yeah. Oldplay. a weird name.
and they're from a town in England. I don't know the town, but they're called The Band. I said, Peter, it's a Coldplay and they're from England originally and Phil is the manager, Phil Harvey, and he says, I'm pretty sure it's Oldplay. definitely it's Oldplay. I Peter, how do we get in touch with him? He goes, I don't know, I hung up on him. It sounded like it was.
It was it was it he used colorful language, but he says sounded like it was some Nigerian prince or something calling me I said Peter Why would you do that? Anyway, long story short we got the call back I took the call this time and it was Phil and he said I'm from Coldplay Chris received this video from our brother Habib I said all that bugger did it that bloody bastard actually did it. So yeah, I Chris then says you want to come and
on stage with me and I'm acting super cool. yeah, know, sure yeah, absolutely mate. And he goes, how excited are you seriously though from one to 10 because I'm hearing that you, you know, we're on your list. And I said, dude, I'm, I'm like, you know, I mean, I'm, I use very colorful language That will, that will be beyond exciting. He goes, that's too much information, mate. And then the rest is, you know, the rest is history.
A brotherhood was born and we met for the first time officially in Melbourne and then that led me to then reaching out to a contact who I had met a few years prior, who I hadn't spoken to. A guy named Rob Goldstein,
he was hosting a concert with a Russian singer named Emin Oglyarov. And Emin was, David Foster was the curator of the concert. He was the player of the concert and he was the guy. And I said, you know what? I have this goal. Yeah. It was...
Adam Callinan (42:34)
Yes.
you
Emmanauel (42:41)
you know do it do something with a superstar like the biggest act in the world one of like the top five and a Legend and David Foster's a legend and I know you you're working with David. So what do you reckon and you know 24 hours later? I got the David Foster gig as well and and I'd achieve all my dreams and this dream this entire dream process started in January and
It was achieved in May and in December I performed with Coldplay. then in, 2018, I began producing my album with Chris and we finished the album at the end of 2018, 2019. We started getting ready to drop a few songs and tidy up a few of the albums and prep a tour and then COVID hit. And then, uh, and then things started to just take their own accord from there. you know,
created a music video during COVID, which I think you know about and featuring some amazing people again with the support of Chris, but we just created a brotherhood Chris and I. But I do remember at the end of 2018, I said to Chris, when are you guys going out on tour again? And he says, don't know man, but probably 2019 or probably 2020, I think it was actually. And then COVID hit. And I said, well, that's awesome man. I'm gonna be on your next tour. Yeah, I'm gonna open.
open for you and he goes yeah we can give you a show I go no no no I'm opening your entire Australian New Zealand leg there's no there's no one show mate I'm doing minimum 10 shows I said or no I think it was eight shows I said he goes all right and the rest is history man.
Adam Callinan (44:21)
such a perfect example of
the durability required to get to that point where an opportunity that's like, I'll use outliers as a great word. I know we'll talk about outlier in a second, but as that outlier opportunity that comes out of nowhere that you didn't plan for, that is the thing that makes the thing that happens in business and entrepreneurship stuff all the time. And it's about being resilient enough and anti-fragile enough to at least make it to that point, which is hard.
Emmanauel (44:58)
Yeah, think the harder you work... No, sorry, I'll rephrase that. People say the harder you work, the luckier you get. I'm a strong believer that it's a fine balance between smart and hard. You have to work hard, if you're working super hard and you're just banging against a wall like a hedgehog, you're not going to go anywhere.
Right? But if you recognize that wall's probably not gonna break, but if you operate a bit like a fox where you find a way into that, you find a way around that wall or whatever it is. So I think you have to have that fine balance between working hard and working smart. And I had to recognize that very, very quickly and very, very forcefully in some ways where I needed to...
you know, there was a, two things. There was a quote that I saw that said, it's none of my business what anybody else thinks about me. It's only my business what I think about myself. So that, that stimulated that belief in self-love again, because as long as I just appreciated, embraced myself, I was gold in that sense. And that operates as the most powerful shield to deflect any negative feedback that affects your own mental state, right?
in a negative way, right? So mental state to be smarter, different story, but mental state that, you know, is about the way you look or the way you appear. No, that stuff, right? To flex against that. Then there's the, there's the aspect of, of, of, of, operating in a way that is, smart by surrounding yourself with the five people you want, like you,
you want to see a little bit of yourself in, if that makes sense, or vice versa. So, you know, the five people you surround yourself with are a representative of who you want to be. And so I knew that in my case, I can't, I can't do five people, right? I just, don't have five fingers, so I'm not, right? So my figures, instead of surrounding myself with five people,
Adam Callinan (47:00)
It does. Yeah.
Emmanauel (47:24)
just surround myself with however many people it takes, but as long as they represent the person I wanna be, right? Because each individual has their own piece of wisdom to give, right? You, it's a brotherhood and advice and friendship and all that sort of stuff, right? But then somebody else on the other side, it might be more from a...
from a very music driven business concept, right? Whatever it So each individual had its own aspect to that motion going forward. But working smart, just because you work hard, it doesn't mean you're gonna succeed. You've got to work hard and you've got to work smart. And if you feel like you're not smart enough to achieve the thing you want to achieve, then find somebody that is.
smart enough and work with them and let them give you that lead. Let them help you get to that place. And that's that I think, you know, if you look at most billionaires, know, Elon Musk doesn't create his own cars. So it's people around him. And I think that's the one thing that I've had to really learn the hard way is
If I'm not an expert in that world, I'm not touching it. I'll find somebody that knows their shit and we'll work together on it. And I'll envision it and yeah.
Adam Callinan (49:00)
Let's talk before we close up here, let's talk about Outlier. You and Chris started, and correct me that's wrong, I don't know how that thing is set up for my understanding. That's what it was. Started this company, what does Outlier do?
Emmanauel (49:05)
Yeah. Yep.
Yeah, so Chris and I did co-found Outlier. He actually is massively responsible for the name, funny enough. I just told him what the purpose of the company was and he says, that's the name. Outlier, our goal is to place Outliers in front of and behind the camera. So we're a film and television company, not a charity.
for profit, let me make that very clear. But our goal is to place differently abled behind and in front of the camera. The Outly community is made up of people with nonconforming mental health, neurodiversity, exclusory conditions, like autoimmune disease and stroke and things like that, carers, physical disability.
those are your, those are your, those, that's the outlier community. The outlier community, not including the carers and not including non-conforming mental health makes up about 13.5 trillion. Actually, it's gone up to about 18 trillion in annual disposable income, 125 billion in film and television, annual disposable income just for film and television distributors and streamers, which is completely untapped. And when I saw that stat,
I immediately thought a light bulb moment hit and I thought, maybe this is, this is part of my purpose. I, not everybody has a Chris Martin in their life and I do. And I can utilize who he is and his, his credibility, his, his pool and his global brand awareness to, to, to, to raise up other outliers in the world. and I'm using him to already raise me up. So, so, so.
It's like the song you raise me up to raise me up in order for me to be able to raise others up. So Outlier is a film and television company that places differently abled and or outliers in front of and behind the camera. Our whole philosophy is zero barrier casting and zero barrier crewing. That's the method that we go. None of our projects have anything to do with the narrative of what
this community goes through or a narrative about the community. It's all very highly commercial content. Our whole philosophy when we cast and when we make these movies is a casual inclusion model because that's how society is. So it's representative of the way society is, right? When I'm walking down the street and I see
you know, an outlier. not, I'm not asking them, what happened? You poor bastard. No, no, no. I'm just saying, yeah, if I can, if I can do that, so can you. So I'm not, I'm not, know, you get yourself up those stairs, mate, or whatever it is, you know? so it's, it's, it is the way society is. And so we wanted to represent society in the most authentic way possible through fun commercial content. We have a live music division as well. So we've got,
live music events. we're partnering with some awesome organizations, sporting events and things like that to host and produce some of their events and place Outliers in those events alongside other superstars. it's really kind of bringing the Outlier community into the mainstream market and mainstream audience and the disposable income is there. So it's not like it's, you know, it's got to be done as a charity case. So that's Outlier.
Adam Callinan (52:50)
Yeah. Amazing.
And that's outlier with a Y, right?
Emmanauel (52:54)
Outlight with a Y and a zero.
Actually, it's a zero for zero barrier, zero barrier, zero barrier casting, zero barrier crewing. So it's spelled with a zero and spelled with a Y. Mainly for this one reason and it's actually kind of a little contradicting to what we're trying to achieve from an accessibility front. But the people that find us are supposed to find us and need to find us. So.
Adam Callinan (53:00)
I didn't realize that.
Emmanauel (53:23)
And frankly, don't want to be, our whole philosophy is we want to be the man behind the successes. We want to be the girl behind the success. We want to be the human, the they, the non-gender specific thing behind that success. For us, it's not about, you know, for us it's not necessarily about...
everybody needs to everybody needs to know us. Everybody needs to know our name. I think for us, as long as we, you know, people start embracing the name, but not necessarily need to know who we are per se that that to me is a success. It's about our brands. It's about what we're launching through the brands. It's about our message and it's about our, our, our impact.
Adam Callinan (54:15)
Incredible. Where do you want people to find you? Find out liar.
Emmanauel (54:22)
You can go to outlier.com, spell it with a zero, but as well, if you spell it with an O and a Y, you'll find us, so it's pretty good. But yeah, you can go to outlier.com. You can go to Emmanuel Kelly, official on Instagram. I don't do anything else. I mean, actually I do. X, I'm doing that now. have 13 followers. I know, three followers. I'm following 13 people, but I have three followers, so there we go. Obviously LinkedIn, I'm also on there.
Adam Callinan (54:40)
Okay. All right.
Yeah.
Emmanauel (54:51)
And but mainly yeah Instagram's your best place and then you can also go to outlier official on Instagram as well So and that's spelt with an O so to make it easier for people If they want to find us, but which is again contradicting to my statement. I just made Just drop all the links, but yeah, it's it's just outlier comm and outlier official on on on Instagram
Adam Callinan (55:10)
That's fine. I'll drop all the links so people can just click buttons.
Epic. I very much appreciate you taking the time. Yeah, just email me directly. Yeah, I appreciate it, man. You have played a big role. You're like my, you know the bracelets, I'm not gonna get, we don't need to go down, really just rabbit holes here, but are like the, what would Jesus do bracelets? I feel like I need to make a, what would a manual do bracelet? When I'm facing something or dealing with something,
Emmanauel (55:25)
They can also contact you. They can also contact you. To be honest, yeah.
Yes.
Yes!
Adam Callinan (55:48)
This is like the amazing resets of perspective that I seek out constantly. Dealing with something that I feel like is hard. How would Emmanuel approach this thing? And I know exactly what would happen. What do you do is like crack a joke, say F it and move on, which is exactly what I should do in those situations of dealing with something that I think is difficult.
Emmanauel (56:00)
Yes.
Yeah. Yes. Yeah. It's only about how you
feel. Just because somebody thinks it's difficult. What do you think? Right? If you feel it's also difficult, then it's difficult. Then you probably got to find a way out. Now, what I like to do is
Adam Callinan (56:21)
The problem
with that, Emmanuel, is that most of the time what the masses, I'm included in that somewhere, think is difficult. Those things are not actually difficult. They're just things that we're worried about because we don't have enough other things to worry about. Like our Maslow's hierarchy of needs is filled up in the emerged economy in the United States for the most part, not for everybody, but for the most part.
Emmanauel (56:32)
NO!
Yes.
Adam Callinan (56:46)
our Maslow's hierarchy of needs is filled up. So we go and find these things to stress out about that are really not worth stressing about. And that's my point is like, what are the things that I do in my life? And I'm very conscious of this. I've grown to be over the last 15 years that I feel like, you know, that bother me or that, you know, trigger me or whatever it is, they're never important. If you like, take a step back, they're never important.
Emmanauel (56:52)
Exactly.
Never. I also like to do like, I know most people do horse riding and whatever it is that just clear their minds. I actually like, because it doesn't actually clear my mind. It puts my mind on overdrive, which I like because if my mind is in overdrive thinking about a thousand things, it's not thinking about the thing that I need to be worried about. And therefore that overdrive finds me a solution. It's weird. But what I do,
It's like a calming overdrive. So what I'll do is I'll watch a movie. literally will literally turn my phone off for two hours and watch a movie. Or I'll play PS5, right? I'll literally just throw on the PS machine and I'll start playing a game. Or I'll sit outside and just lie down and just have a nap, you know? And I think just...
Adam Callinan (57:49)
Yeah, nice.
Emmanauel (58:05)
Finding those bits of of your day that you can just escape for 30 minutes is key number one and also I would say every Friday Make sure that when when when you're done on Friday, you can still work through the weekend, but remember it's a weekend Remember, it's a weekend weekends are there for a reason. So remember it's a weekend use it be with your family
still in your off, you know, when your family's in bed and you know, you want to just do a little bit of whatever you want to do, send a few emails. Fine. Do it at night when everyone's asleep or during a movie or whatever it is, but it's a weekend. So enjoy that weekend. Embrace it. Me and Joe, we literally rate our weekends. We have literally created a rating system for our week. Right. How is our food this week? And I'm writing this much. Like we actually try and outdo
Adam Callinan (58:54)
That's great.
Emmanauel (59:02)
every weekend we have to make it even better and more enjoyable and peaceful. And it's the simple things. So I think I never used to do that, but, I never used to embrace the weekend because I always thought I had to be keeping going all the time, all the time, all the time. And I realized in the last 12 months before even I even got like, when I got the Coldplay gig, I realized that
I've been able to achieve more in the last 12 months. And this was before people even knew I was performing with Coldplay. So it wasn't even announced, but I'd achieved more in that 12 months because of this system I put in place that I had in those four years of rebuild. And that was simply because I worked hard, but also smart. And part of that smart work was also recognizing when I needed to just.
Adam Callinan (59:51)
Mmph.
Emmanauel (1:00:01)
relax and not chase, not chase, allow that to come to me. Put it out there, let people know you're searching and you're wanting to do it, but then allow those human beings, and you gotta still follow up every now and then, but allow them to think, hang on a minute, Emmanuel hasn't chased me, that's a bit weird, it's unusual, okay, maybe I need to check in on it, you know what mean? Anyway, I'm rambling.
Adam Callinan (1:00:02)
Yeah.
No, it's epic. Great idea. Thanks a ton, man. Really appreciate it.
Emmanauel (1:00:33)
You too, brother?